Hey guys. I have recently been looking into the idea of caging the 510 to stiffen up the body enough to cope with the extra power that is going through it.

KNOWING how much of a pain in the arse it is to get the front of the car stiff AND connected to the rear makes me try to think of other ways. I asked Lindsay Stone about the cage situation/laws and he referred to them as "tricky". One thing he mentioned that might help quite a bit is laying some fresh metal along the length of the sill.

Being as they are, the sill in these cars (and most older cars), as a little... thinner, than they were coming out of the line at factory.

Aside from the angle bracing in the front wheel well and the rear stut bracing up to the parcel shelf.


Along with ideas like strut braces along the front, Anyone have some nifty little tricks like this that will help to stiffen things up??

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The Gene Pool Needs More Chlorine.

Hey mate. I am currently looking at buying a mig welder and thinking of stitch welding a lot of the car. Have heard a lot of good feedback on how much it ties together the front and rear and let's suspension do all the work. Minimizes flexing. I am looking at doing all the engine bay, firewall, floor sections, rear strut towers etc. I'm also looking into running 3mm plate or box sectioning the chassis. I still have more research to do on the box sectioning and also asking the engineer or mm the best way to do this. Hope this helps mate. With the stitch welding I will be welding an inch leaving an inch etc. Just doing a tach and moving to the opposite strut tower and tacking there and going backwards and forwards to minimize heat in the panel to avoid warping.

This thread is the place to discuss and has some interesting stuff. Plus I've tested most of it and it makes a bit of difference!
http://www.ozdat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=11103

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1972 Datsun 1600, S14 SR20DET Engineered (204rwkW @ 17psi.)
viewtopic.php?t=6579
#SR20Datsun @SR20Datsun

I filled my chassis rails, door sills, a and c pillars (i don't have a b pillar). chassis cross brace, k frame, rear arms and any other place I thought it would help with special 2 part expandable foam. Got the idea from Baz and then enquired about it with others that have done this. It is water proof and it stiffened my chassis enormously. My car now drives totally different and you can feel the suspension work. I know Rally cars and drift cars do the same also . I chose to go this way as I did not want to install a cage.

Its quite cheap stuff, however the problem is that you can only buy it in small amounts overseas and the cost of shipping blows it out of the roof. Or you can buy a whole heap of it from Oz but then alot will go to waste because you wont use it all. noone is oz sell it in the small amounts.

Note it is a very messy process as i pours out of every hole that exits in that space! and the product will expire about 2 months after you break the seal.

Do not use expandable foam in a can from bunnings as this will not set correctly when the oxygen in the air inside the rail runs out. The reason being is that the 2 part stuff is not dependent on oxygen for the reaction, but on the the two chemicals that are mixed. The bunnings stuff reacts with Oxygen to work so its not good in enclosed places. The bunnings stuff also has a lesser density when it sets and i dont think its water proof.

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Everyone has a photographic memory... Some just don't have film

Datsun 610/180B SSS FJ22 700 rwhp on E85
Datsun 810/200B SSS FJ20 (current build)

I added 50mm box tube along inside of sils, from cage main hoop to firewall. Not exactly an easy mod for a car that's finished, but a great way to strengthen front end of car during paint n panel stages. Pics are in my build thread, you can hardly tell its there with scuff plates and black carpet

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1600 with FJ20 & Simmons. something different.

Super,

This is an incredible plan!!! This little bit of info is why I posted this thread I have gone through the linked thread above but, if this bit of advice is there, I missed it. My car is a shell at the moment so, when I know where everything will be going, this is probably going to happen. I have a few mates with race cars so I might have a chat with them about splitting the bill for the foam and sharing the goods between us.

Really appreciate the reply mate, AWESOME bit of info!!!
DAT04,

This is the straight forward approach that was in my head to do. I will DEFs be checking out your build thread for some images on what you done did.

Thanks for that mate

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The Gene Pool Needs More Chlorine.

No probz, happy to help

if you need product info let me know and I will send it through.

If you can get a few guys in on it, it will cost you almost nothing for an tremendous mod that will massively increase chassis stiffness. When I did it noone was interested so I had to cop the whole cost myself . Even so it was well worth it.

oh yeah dont get the sh*t on your hands because it takes days to come off

I would give Baz from Datsport a call, and pick his brain. He will have alot more info on this...

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Everyone has a photographic memory... Some just don't have film

Datsun 610/180B SSS FJ22 700 rwhp on E85
Datsun 810/200B SSS FJ20 (current build)

I was always worried about water and moisture retention with this stuff.
Very curious to know how resistant it is.
I have painted inside my sills and chassis rails to reduce rust appearing and would not be sure how well this stuff would stick to that surface. It would have to key in somehow either chemically or mechanically.
If it doesn't bond to the surface it would be useless as a strengthening system.

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1972 Datsun 1600, S14 SR20DET Engineered (204rwkW @ 17psi.)
viewtopic.php?t=6579
#SR20Datsun @SR20Datsun

I can tell you it bonds to skin very well lol

It definitely bonds to the surfaces it touches, and is a prick to get off (i had to learn the hard way). Baz might have a better scientific explanation. so far i know it bonds to metal, powder-coated surfaces, painted surfaces oh yeah and concrete. I did my research in regards to the water proofing factor because I was worried about rust populating but with further research I was assured that it would improve this issue as it would create an air tight seal. Also take into account that when the foam expands in an enclosed area its density will be much higher again. All my calcs were on it being used in open areas. so the fact that its in an enclosed area these characteristics will definitely increase to work to an advantage.

This foam reacts in about a minute. So you need to block off as many holes in that space as possible and pump into the cavity as much as you can when its flowing out of all the minute holes that you never knew about its done the foam will keep expanding at a rate higher (much higher) than what is flowing out the small holes. The foam will solidify within a minute or so, be sure to have all the areas prepped so there is no stop starts. or you will need to change the gun tip if you stop for more that 2 mins.

BTW cover any area you dont want the foam to stick to.

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Everyone has a photographic memory... Some just don't have film

Datsun 610/180B SSS FJ22 700 rwhp on E85
Datsun 810/200B SSS FJ20 (current build)

I would be keen for a group buy of this expandable foam. If people are looking to buy PM me and we can order some as a group

I like the idea of welding in a length of tubing along the sills. Would it be worth doing without a cage?

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build-threads.com

Anth510,

I have been told it makes a MASSIVE difference from Lindsay Stone and it stand to reason that it'd help a lot. Just a matter of fixing it to something worthwhile under there

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The Gene Pool Needs More Chlorine.

Has anyone got pics of this tubing or box section from the hoop to the firewall. Sounds like a great idea. I'm going with 6 point cage, stitch welding the whole of the car, extra supports under front guard and also rear strut towers to parcel shelf and also from gearbox and tail shaft tunnel to sill, expandable foam inside sills and pillars etc, and now box sectioning from hoop to firewall. Still looking into running 3mm plates along chassis rails and adding gussets to chassis. Should be quite a strong body and chassis I would hope. Then also front and rear strut brace and front sway bar.

Do you know anyone who packs fragile bulky items for shipping? We used to use expanding foam for packing overhauled components. If you ask the question, you might be able to take your prepared shell to them and fill everything. Saves having to hire or buy the pump system and more foam mix than you will ever use, then try to get rid of it after.

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Trev

There's something about twin webers at full noise.

The only thing is do they use the right foam. Probably use the normal foam not the 2 pac stuff that holds and has water in it. But a good idea if it's the right stuff